Choice of rotary tools

This topic contains 62 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  mcmasterp 1 month, 1 week ago.

Viewing 30 posts - 1 through 30 (of 63 total)
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  • #2181

    geodave
    Participant

    I have not picked out a rotary tool yet & thought I would start a thread to see what different rotary tools people are using with this cool CNC machine and how they are attaching them. I started to buy the harbor freight http://www.harborfreight.com/flexible-shaft-grinder-and-carver-40432.html that was mentioned on thingiverse since their was a 20% off an item this weekend, but with the comments on it overheating I decided to pass. Maybe all these types of tools will have some heat buildup running continuously. I saw the designer of this project was using the Foredom flex shaft which is quite a bit more expensive, but if it is a lot more durable it may be worth it in the long run. This place is about the best price I have found for a Foredom so far. http://www.ottofrei.com/Foredom-K.2230-Flex-Shaft-Kit.html
    I am not sure if that is the model that Allted is using.

    Anyway, I would like to hear what other people are using & how they are hooking them up to this CNC machine. I would really like to spend somewhere in the $100 or less range for this.

    -David

    #2185

    coolreactions
    Participant

    I have the harbor freight spindle set, but used a Foredom hand piece, I would not buy it again, bearings wore out fast and still has some play after replacing the bearings. The one that comes with the harbor freight works fine but it does not use 1/4 bits. I have run the motor 6 hours straight without issues, and have about 50 hours on it so far.

    #2187

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    I bought a generic flex shaft rotary tool from amazon, for $60. I didn’t like the hand piece that came with it because the chuck fell off during use, it was press fit. So I bought a foredom 43t hand piece from ebay for $40. It has been perfect, 3 size collets, barely even gets warm. It all depends what you want to cut. I wanted the extra power for occasional aluminum. If you aren’t doing metal, just get the harbor freight faux dremel, I have one and it’s pretty nice.

    I tried to find a link, I was sure it was the same as the harbor freight one.

    Remember to lube the flex shaft with white lithium often.

    #2197

    geodave
    Participant

    I am starting to like the idea of getting mini bench grinder that has a flex shaft attachment. I currently do not have a grinder, so it might serve double duty for me. I wonder if it will be more noisy though. There are quite a variety of these out there. Here is one link on Amazon. http://www.amazon.com/Electr-Bench-Grinder-Polisher-Shaft/dp/B005ZUR1IO/ref=pd_sim_sbs_469_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=197GEXY1Y42Z9HJRTRPG

    Harbor freight has one of these also. http://www.harborfreight.com/bench-grinder-with-flex-shaft-43533.html

    The flex shaft length is 42″ for that one on Amazon & the harbor freight one is only 31″. Seems like I will loose at least 12″ in length with the bends of cable with the grinder at the side middle.

    #2239

    geodave
    Participant

    Here are some links I have found on router options to use that other people might be interested in taking a look at. I am mostly going to cut wood to begin with, but eventually would like to be able to cut or drill 6061 T6 Aluminum in order to make a new build plate for my 3d printer.

    http://reprap.org/wiki/Milling_and_Drilling_Head

    http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/Spindle_Options

    I like the idea of using the Dewalt DW660 ($52) which gives you a 1/4″ collet. It is single speed but can be used with a router speed control ($32 from Amazon, $20 from harbor Freight) with some success. It is a bit heavier (3.2lbs) than some of these other options. Is that too heavy for this design?
    http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/DW660

    How well do you think the Proxxon 28512 12-Volt Micromot 50 EF Rotary Tool would work with this design? It is $53 & you also have to buy the $30 power supply to run it.
    http://www.amazon.com/Proxxon-28512-12-Volt-Micromot-Rotary/dp/B000S5KO3K

    I already have one of these Mastergrip tools listed below, so I was thinking about trying this to start with since the only cost would be in designing a tool holder to fit it. This weighs 18.6oz.
    http://www.amazon.com/Mastergrip-190pc-Rotary-Tool-Accessory/dp/B005HKMASS

    Here is another inexpensive option that has a flex shaft for it. This is rated at 1amp, so it is probably about the same power rating as the Mastergrip I have.
    http://www.amazon.com/WEN-2305-Rotary-Tool-Shaft/dp/B003BYRFH8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1435618307&sr=1-1&keywords=wen+rotary+tool+kit+w+flexible+shaft

    Speed Control options
    http://www.amazon.com/MLCS-9400-Standard-Router-Control/dp/B001JHQ3G8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1435618666&sr=1-1&keywords=router+speed+control
    http://www.harborfreight.com/router-speed-control-43060.html

    #2619

    D34532
    Participant

    Hi all,

    I have not finish printing my parts yet but wondering if anyone have tried and use Proxxon’s rotary tool? I have their pro rotary IBS/E model and was thinking about testing it when I get everything built.

    #2675

    kawobei
    Participant

    50 watts is that enough grunt to cut what you want? Or is the flex shaft the weak point anyway?

    #2699

    joeskilton
    Participant

    Anyone seen these: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/CNC-400W-Spindle-Motor-ER11-with-Mount-bracket-for-engraving-lathe-Grinding-set-/141658538626?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item20fb81c282

    Is there a downside that I’m missing? Should have less run-out than a cheap dremel (for a similar price).

    #2700

    joeskilton
    Participant

    They say 0.01 to 0.03mm accuracy, that’s got to be way better than a dremel (my dremel has 0.5 to 1mm, admittedly it’s a cheapo but…)

    #2701

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    You still need a power supply and a speed controller. That brings the price up. 400W is about the smallest you should do. I think they are really nice just a bit expensive. I’m trying to work a bulk order price…

    #2702

    kawobei
    Participant

    Do you mean 400watts of cutting power should be the minimum spindle we should aim at?

    #2703

    joeskilton
    Participant

    Inventables have a 300W speed controller for 35 bucks. I agree a bulk ordering to get the price down would be great, mark me down for one.

    Do you think speed control is needed for this application? Couldn’t we just run it flat out the whole time?

    #2704

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    Spindle ~$80, speed controller (Necessary) ~$35, power supply ~$70.

    I keep trying spindles, I haven’t cut with the dw660 yet but it seems great for ~$55 plus $5.99 for a dimmer. Don’t remember off the top of my head but it’s around 600 watts. I have it mounted and everything but I can’t find any spare time yet. Another user has used his twice and says it is good and is running cool so far. I’ll post a video ASAP.

    Depends on what you are cutting but I’d say anything under 300W is going to take a really long time to do anything but foam, or maybe PCB’s.

    I am not an expert in this stuff, I just keep buying and trying, so you don’t have too.

    #2705

    joeskilton
    Participant

    I can’t get the DW660 in AUS, apparently it’s 110V only. Shame.

    I can get these though: http://www.makita.com.au/products/power-tools/item/rt0700cx-roumer-635mm which look to fit the requirements. They are 1.8KG though – is that too heavy?

    Also concerns me how bulky they are.

    #2706

    kawobei
    Participant

    I use the makita on my shapeoko

    #2707

    joeskilton
    Participant

    Have you built a Mostly Printed yet?

    Wondering whether the Shapeoko is more rigid? Don’t really want to spend the 200 for nothing.

    #2708

    kawobei
    Participant

    Waiting on bearings and still printing.

    Sorry

    It is fairly heavy.

    #2710

    geodave
    Participant

    I am still trying to figure out which rotary tool to eventually buy, but still going to try the rotary tool I have to start with since I only have to buy end mills. I found this End Mill Starter set for 1/8″ shank that looks like a good 5 piece set to start with for $20.
    https://www.inventables.com/technologies/end-mill-starter-set-18-in-shank

    They also have a quiet cut 300watt spindle for $80, but you still have to get the power supply & speed controller.

    #2712

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    I would shop around a bit.

    Definitely use your rotary tool, it might just do what you want. If you choose to upgrade go bigger than the 300W.

    #2715

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    Okay I finally tested the new setup.

    I had a bad file so the part didn’t come out but I’m uploading a few quick snippets of video.

    So I have no idea why it is cutting so much better but it could be that I finally screwed it down (it was double sided taped before), the new better middle z part, or the dw660 spindle but this thing was killing it! When the file screwed up I had it at 120% feed rate and it was cutting at least 3mm at a pass in red oak and it wasn’t having any issues I could have went deeper or faster!

    Setting were .6 DOC, 25mm/s +120% no problems

    PS I need to make a new forum for hardware, this is getting jumbled.

    #2716

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    I did edit the speed, accel, and jerk settings. I will upload the new firmware when I do another proper test cut.

    If you are feeling froggy here is what I had in there.

    #define DEFAULT_AXIS_STEPS_PER_UNIT {200,200,4535.44,760*1.1} // default steps per unit for Ultimaker
    #define DEFAULT_MAX_FEEDRATE {9000, 9000, 150, 25} // (mm/sec)
    #define DEFAULT_MAX_ACCELERATION {600,600,90,800} // X, Y, Z, E maximum start speed for accelerated moves. E default values are good for Skeinforge 40+, for older versions raise them a lot.

    #define DEFAULT_ACCELERATION 600 // X, Y, Z and E max acceleration in mm/s^2 for printing moves
    #define DEFAULT_RETRACT_ACCELERATION 600 // X, Y, Z and E max acceleration in mm/s^2 for retracts

    // Offset of the extruders (uncomment if using more than one and relying on firmware to position when changing).
    // The offset has to be X=0, Y=0 for the extruder 0 hotend (default extruder).
    // For the other hotends it is their distance from the extruder 0 hotend.
    // #define EXTRUDER_OFFSET_X {0.0, 20.00} // (in mm) for each extruder, offset of the hotend on the X axis
    // #define EXTRUDER_OFFSET_Y {0.0, 5.00} // (in mm) for each extruder, offset of the hotend on the Y axis

    // The speed change that does not require acceleration (i.e. the software might assume it can be done instantaneously)
    #define DEFAULT_XYJERK 4 // (mm/sec)
    #define DEFAULT_ZJERK 0.4 // (mm/sec)
    #define DEFAULT_EJERK 5.0 // (mm/sec)

    #2772

    joeskilton
    Participant

    I have purchased the Makita, it’s awesome.

    The makita is easy as to mount and I found the blank tool mount on thingiverse but I can’t figure out how to get the STL into fusion 360 so I can edit it, does anyone know how to do it?

    #2774

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    I added some generic parasolids that should help.

    http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:805803

    My SolidWorks is acting funny so please let me know if these don’t work and I can try and re-save these on my lunch break at work.

    #2776

    joeskilton
    Participant

    Brilliant, thanks. They work great.

    Once I print and test the mount I’ve designed I’ll put it on Thingiverse to share.

    I’m impressed by the body on this Makita, it’s a perfect 65mm cylinder of machined aluminum, makes alignment so easy!

    #2798

    stonesifer
    Participant

    Replaced Dremel with variable speed 1 hp Bosch palm router….wow…what a difference. Now printing the remix middle Z’s….hoping for better stability.

    #2817

    kawobei
    Participant

    Pictures?

    #2861

    SteveC
    Participant

    I just got the Makita (RT0701C 1-1/4 HP, 6.5A compact router) from Home Depot for $99. It weighs less than that stated above, it is 3lb 1oz (1.39Kg) without the unused base plate. I read that the DW660 weighs 1.18Kg on the Shapeoko forum. That is about a 7oz difference.

    The Makita has a built-in speed controller from 10000 to 30000 RPM which is a pretty good range for CNC use.

    One drawback of the Makita is that to use 1/8″ bits it either needs a 1/4 to 1/8 collet reducer or a custom collet from:
    http://www.elairecorp.com/makitaroutercollets.html
    The custom collet supposedly has a very good runout spec.

    The Makita RT0701C:
    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Makita-1-1-4-HP-Compact-Router-RT0701C/204247210
    http://www.amazon.com/Makita-RT0701C-1-1-Compact-Router/dp/B00E7D3V4S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1439763744&sr=8-1&keywords=RT0701C

    Useful spindle info:
    http://www.shapeoko.com/wiki/index.php/Spindle_Options

    #2862

    Ryan
    Keymaster

    There are a few reasons I don’t go with that one but the biggest is how far from the axis it is going to need to be. The closer the cutting bit is to the center of the z axis (or where the X and Y cross) the better. Linear force multiplier the further out you go. So I didn’t think you could make use of all that extra power without some serious chattering. It might be rigid enough for it, I can’t wait to see how it works. If we can cram 1.5 HP on here that would be insane. But the Dewalt for $55 has more than enough power for what I’ve tried and it comes with 1/8th and 1/4 collets.

    I’m more of a bang for your buck guy.

    #2863

    SteveC
    Participant

    Really good point on the Z axis offset. I will see how close I can mount it.

    Remember that the DeWalt needs a (Frankenstein/Light Dimmer:) speed controller.

    #2864

    kawobei
    Participant

    I don’t think we can get the dewalt in Aus 🙁 that’s why we pretty much have to go for the Makita

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